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Postby Oramac » Wed Feb 27, 2008 11:21 pm

this post makes me want to put on my SD gear and see how long i can hold VR. since i can get damned near 600 SD totally unbuffed, i think it'd be good fun.
Aplus wrote:Yeah every time I get a big head, I go and try to solo a warlock.brings me back down to earth pretty fast
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Postby Ilara » Wed Feb 27, 2008 11:21 pm

ironically I was taken to a VR last night in which I absolutely flipped my lid at the people for.

told I was to tank VR first up;
bust all my consumables, food, flask, oil whatnot etc etc. flask cost me 40g, bought it in case this exactly would happen so I could show off a bit...

20 seconds before pull "Oh, nah, well have Lokaz (t5 warrior) go in first" - Im thinking someone was talking "behind the scenes" so to speak... I wasn't happy...
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Postby Lewyn » Thu Feb 28, 2008 12:14 am

Yar, it always seems like people like to conspire against tankadins. Bah, I say. BAH!
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Postby Baldihar » Thu Feb 28, 2008 3:07 am

Happens to the best of us...

Tanked VR the other night with another Pally tank and our MT warrior. I have the Warrior by atleast 1500hps even with his Commanding Shout running, i have superior avoidance, and armor, but yet they still believe he should MT because they have the Warrior mentality. The other paladin is still trying to work on his gear to be able to tank a fight like that... Poor guy didnt have enough Spell Dmg but somehow he managed to stay close to me and the Warrior MT.

Anyways, we all run in, warrior charges VR and grabs initial aggro, me and the other tankadin pop wings and start our spell rotations. I was running right at 500SD and didn't need but maybe one Misdirect the whole fight. and the warrior and I stayed neck and neck for top aggro with him getting the majority of the MDs when he got bounced back...

It is a fun test of our tanking team's ability to work together.

On the other hand they still don't let me tank Gruul. Last time I tried, I nubbed it up and missed the pull with Avenger's Shield, and the 2 druid tanks I was with charged in and got their aggro going so I played catch-up the rest of the fight.

But my guild loves Paladin tanks... i was the first one in the guild and for a long time the only one... now we have invited 3 more... /sigh
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Postby Avengedsoul » Thu Feb 28, 2008 3:29 am

Ill tell you my bad VR expirience.
I've tanked it last night, asked our kind warrior's if i could start tanking him, so i wont go oom if i start offtanking it.
Used about 600 SD, the Al'ar trinket, wings, JoC, even manapots at some point cause i was spamming my spells so much. Managed too keep it on me till he was on 3%... i was so sad ! :-)
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Postby Ilara » Thu Feb 28, 2008 3:50 am

probably a question better suited to the actual strat forum than a bad experiences thread, but how the hell do you keep up threat with everyone properly when not MTing him, I have a horrid time, run oom and drop so far behind its questionable if Im worth showing up...
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Postby Songblade » Thu Feb 28, 2008 3:54 am

Oh that's ok, after VR we decided to do Gruul's Lair, and on the way I asked if I could tank HKM. They said sure, and when we went in there, I pulled him to me, and proceeded to tank him.

I died shortly after we killed the priest, and as I looked at my Grim Reaper, it said that in a 9 second duration I had only dodged 2 out of 7 attacks, all of which hit for between 4k and 6k, and had only gotten 1 significant heal, and it was for 5k...

I was willing to chock it up to bad luck (hell, that's what it was), but the rest of the raid wanted to let the warrior tank take it the rest of the way... and here I am, looking like an undergeared idiot.

I looked up the warrior's stats after the raid btw, and I have roughly 2k less health than him unbuffed, but less armor and less avoidance than me, so it really was a mix of bad luck and poorly placed heals, and it made me look very bad.
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Postby Baldihar » Thu Feb 28, 2008 4:00 am

Ilara wrote:probably a question better suited to the actual strat forum than a bad experiences thread, but how the hell do you keep up threat with everyone properly when not MTing him, I have a horrid time, run oom and drop so far behind its questionable if Im worth showing up...


I actually sacrificed about 2% of my crushability so I could have some higher Spell dmg. I ran with Spell Dmg food and oil. and held him for a good bit.

I chug pots like crazy, I don't down rank crap until I get really close to OOM before my pots are refreshed, and use SoTC, and Seal of Vengeance. so even if I get knocked back, it still ticks away for my aggro. Other than that, get all the Misdirects you can.

you should be getting dmg'ed when he does that pounding crap or when a Melee'er catches an orb so should be getting a bit of mana back from that.
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Postby Baldihar » Thu Feb 28, 2008 4:03 am

Songblade wrote:Oh that's ok, after VR we decided to do Gruul's Lair, and on the way I asked if I could tank HKM. They said sure, and when we went in there, I pulled him to me, and proceeded to tank him.

I died shortly after we killed the priest, and as I looked at my Grim Reaper, it said that in a 9 second duration I had only dodged 2 out of 7 attacks, all of which hit for between 4k and 6k, and had only gotten 1 significant heal, and it was for 5k...

I was willing to chock it up to bad luck (hell, that's what it was), but the rest of the raid wanted to let the warrior tank take it the rest of the way... and here I am, looking like an undergeared idiot.

I looked up the warrior's stats after the raid btw, and I have roughly 2k less health than him unbuffed, but less armor and less avoidance than me, so it really was a mix of bad luck and poorly placed heals, and it made me look very bad.


And that is the reason I have eavesdrop. I am not shy about dropping a dime on the healers when they can't heal me for 9 freakin seconds. or I get one flash heal in there and take a 6k hit right after.

I wished there was a way to post the log into raid chat.
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Postby Songblade » Thu Feb 28, 2008 4:06 am

QFT
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Postby Snake-Aes » Thu Feb 28, 2008 5:12 am

Worldie complained about that a few weeks ago...Seems people keep thinking that having our name in pink on the raid panels means we're healing >.>

Every time I die in the raid it's because I don't get heals for 6+ seconds, it's annoying. The single exception to this is prince because, well, I usually tank him with the 2 or 3 healers that always heal me in heroics. At least they remember i'm the guy that stands the punishment.


I wonder what's in the head of a healer when they are healing in a raid, because..damn... 6 to 10 seconds without heals... Being a 2-tank fight with 6 healers.... UGH >.>
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Postby Exodius » Thu Feb 28, 2008 5:40 am

I went to see VR two days ago. I had a shocker a few weeks ago when my gear was a lot worse than it is now. Things just did not go well then and I felt terrible afterwards. To summarise what happened then I went in with everything set, MDs to me, spell damage maxed out, all that stuff, yet duffed up his aggro range as it was the first time I had ever pulled him. I freaked out and cancelled my AS, lost aggro, and eventually got smacked around to the point of death. Health, avoidance, spell damage and armor were a lot lower back then.

Fast forward a few weeks. Since then my equipement has gotten a lot better, and so has the communication with the rest of the tanks and the officers. I've tanked in ZA and have done well in jobs that are assigned to me.

So we came to VR two days ago. I was even tanking the second mechs on the approach, the ones that do freak 14k hits. They sure smart, but with enough healing it can be done.

We face VR with 4 tanks. We all go in, and with a proper AS cast the aggro is jumping all over the place in the first few seconds as MDs go to the other tanks. I just don't get healed as it's not expected that I have aggro initially, and become one of the first to fall.

Next time around things go a bit better, but again I die after the third or forth ground pound when I have aggro. I just was not getting heals, even though I was a known tank, and even though in theory the healers knew I had aggro and it was announced on vent.

4 tanks to juggle is hard on the healers, so they asked me to get out my 2 handed axe and pretend to dps. I don't really mind, I just need to be patient.

The problem as I saw it was with the healers, however. It is good though how I am able to talk freely with the other tanks. We have a seperate tank chat channel which all the tanks and off tanks are on. We use it to talk about who tanks what, why something is working or not working from a tanking perspective, we can make suggestions or requests to the tank leader and vice versa on it. I really appreciate having a voice on that channel and being heard.

It was not my place though to argue about being assigned to dps that fight, or complain too much about the healers. It was obvious they were being strained with 4 tanks to juggle, which is just too many. As I was the one dying the most, then it makes sense for me to step down.

Next time VR comes around we shall have to see. I might suggest the idea of healing the target of target thing, that could help unless he does his tempory orb swapping thing. If that's the case I am sure they can cancel heal and then try again.

We are still learning the fight with a protection paladin in the mix. We do radically change the dynamics with our aggro jumping at the start. Maybe I'll suggest starting off with healers focused on me and not try to choke it. I am learning, they are learning. Eventually we will get there. :D

Draw parallels to your own experiences as you see fit. That's my (parallel) story. No healers being on strike, just the whole raid learning how to do things differently, and hopefully for the better. :D
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Postby Annabelle » Thu Feb 28, 2008 7:32 am

This happened to me two different nights on VR. I got to enjoy looking at my body laying there for almost the entire fight. I've also died several times on the lynx boss, two of his cleave moves a few more seconds go by still no heals, get a dodge, then splat. The raid leader asks, what happened...ummmm, I didn't get healed, that's what happened. It's crazy as I am part of the tank corps, always on the tank windows. Been tanking in the raid since Jan. *shrugs* seems to be an issue with many tankadins
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Postby kvark » Thu Feb 28, 2008 8:26 am

paladins ALWAYS start on VR. In our guild a warrior got a lot of crap for pulling VR just after readycheck. Then again, my guild almost never raid if prot pallies don't go.
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Postby Songblade » Thu Feb 28, 2008 10:03 am

Oh in our guild the warrior pulls VR (mostly because the guild leader hasn't decided I'm ACTUALLY good enough to tank him, despite my superior avoidance and the fact that I have nearly as much health as the MAIN TANK). So what I usually do is stack as much spell damage as I can, throw a shield as soon as the tank pulls, and judge immediately, and last night, I pulled it off not only our MTs gun pull, but the misdirect he had coming to him.
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