LGBT rights discussion

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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Nooska » Fri Aug 16, 2013 11:46 am

Well, that an extreme position claims someone toward steh center (from thier stance) is to that side, doesn't really mean anything.
Its more a point on teh stance of the extremists.
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Shoju » Fri Aug 16, 2013 11:56 am

Klaudandus wrote:
I hope that God, Heaven, and Hell are real, just so you can burn in hell for linking that document to me, you jerk.

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I only linked to provide context to the kind of people that are claiming that Fox News is left-leaning.



I know, I kid really. It's just.... HOLY BATSHIT INSANITY BATMAN.
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Klaudandus » Fri Aug 16, 2013 1:04 pm

Nooska wrote:Well, that an extreme position claims someone toward steh center (from thier stance) is to that side, doesn't really mean anything.
Its more a point on teh stance of the extremists.


Well, yeah, it's all a matter of perspective. They're so far to the right that they broke the doppler effect, and everything looks like its to the left of them.
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Passionario » Mon Sep 02, 2013 11:05 am

Nooska wrote:But.. its russia.. do we really expect sanity from the russian political system?

It's not insane, it's just evil.

The hysterical campaign waged by powers that be against "enemies of Russia" within and without (gays, immigrants, foreign adopters) serves a dual purpose. It redirects the anger and hostility of the population away from themselves, and it serves as a smokescreen for massive cuts to all social programs that are currently under way.

For example, it is no coincidence that proposals to ban gays from donating blood and to increase retirement age for women by 5 years were introduced to the parliament within the same week.
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Paxen » Mon Sep 02, 2013 2:10 pm

Passionario wrote:For example, it is no coincidence that proposals to ban gays from donating blood and to increase retirement age for women by 5 years were introduced to the parliament within the same week.


Russia really scares me. Our neighbour in the north is showing all signs of turning into a fascist dictatorship.
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Klaudandus » Mon Sep 02, 2013 3:51 pm

And the guy that made a painting of Putin and Medeyev in lingerie had to flee the country or risk getting a polonium injection.
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Passionario » Mon Sep 02, 2013 11:37 pm

Klaudandus wrote:And the guy that made a painting of Putin and Medeyev in lingerie had to flee the country or risk getting a polonium injection.

Polonium is for those who do manage to flee the country. Those who stay get thrown into plain old torture-prisons.
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Klaudandus » Tue Sep 03, 2013 4:39 pm

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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Levantine » Tue Sep 03, 2013 8:51 pm

Pandering for votes? Almost certainly, it's cute to hear an Australian politician with a real chance of being Prime Minister say this though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CdU3ooAZSH8
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Klaudandus » Thu Sep 05, 2013 10:11 am

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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Klaudandus » Fri Oct 18, 2013 10:58 am

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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Fivelives » Mon Oct 28, 2013 4:14 am

I'm about half convinced that the entire tea party is nothing but a giant conspiracy on the part of late night talk show hosts to provide themselves with easy comedy material.
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Klaudandus » Tue Nov 19, 2013 6:49 am

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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Io.Draco » Tue Nov 19, 2013 10:24 am

Klaudandus wrote:http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/10/18/tea-party-leader-proposes-class-action-lawsuit-against-homosexuality/


How can you propose a class action lawsuit against...sexual orientation?

Klaudandus wrote:http://hypervocal.com/news/2013/russia-gay-parents/

Holy shit.


Well that's not new, Gay parents don't have rights to adopt children, or marry or have any form of partnership in Russia.
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Skye1013 » Tue Nov 19, 2013 10:32 am

Io.Draco wrote:
Klaudandus wrote:http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/10/18/tea-party-leader-proposes-class-action-lawsuit-against-homosexuality/


How can you propose a class action lawsuit against...sexual orientation?

It's the tea party... don't look for logic.
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Io.Draco » Tue Dec 03, 2013 2:10 pm

I've gotten so fucking tired of this entire debate. Both sides are equally vicious in their fight and if you, God forbid, refuse to be sucked in this debate you will be slammed by both equally as bad with insults and threats because I suppose for the far right it's "If you are not with us then you are working against God's word" and for the liberals it's "If you're not with us then you are against us which makes you a racist, intolerant, homophobic bigot."

I hate both sides equally and think they can go fuck themselves.
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Klaudandus » Tue Dec 03, 2013 3:23 pm

In a sense, I agree.

I've had the unfortunate luck of crossing paths with two trans-whatever. To them, any sort of criticism or disagreement, not even tangentially related to their sexuality, means you're transphobic... what kind of made-up word is that! I ended up just disassociating myself from that social circle that included those douchenozzles rather than deal with them -- but trust me, I came close at exploding at them and going on a lengthy rant.

I came close to telling them "The only reason why I am in favor of LGBT rights is because of my friends, because if it wasn't for them, I'd be against them solely based on what a horrible person YOU are".

I have no real dog in the LGBT rights fight. In a solely personal level, I am not affected with allowing or banning. I choose to stand with my friends in the fight for their rights, because it feels right, because it's the decent thing to do.

But there are people that just make me wanna flip a table and go "fuck it guys" -- like that waitress with the fake receipt.
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Io.Draco » Tue Dec 03, 2013 4:01 pm

I'd be against them solely based on what a horrible person YOU are.


This is exactly how I personally feel about the LGBT movement and in general social justice warriors, including feminists.
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Fridmarr » Tue Dec 03, 2013 7:34 pm

I can understand that. People can be very obnoxious. I do think it's important to separate the cause from the people though.

At the end of the day, I find that there are two objectives I try very hard to meet. First, I need to be able to look myself in the mirror, and know that what I believe in is right/moral. I don't want to believe in something because someone is influencing me. Whether that someone is a family member, an activist, an actor, a friend, a politician with a certain letter next to his name etc. I'm responsible to myself in my beliefs.

Secondly, I need to be open to the fact that I could be wrong, and willing to listen to the other side. Both can be challenging at times, especially the second, but I've gotten into the habit of reminding myself of these concepts and that helps. I think having that mindset allows me to utterly disregard the seething vile that can be spewed by either side of an issue. It also opened my eyes a bit to exactly how similar both sides on most issues are.
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Koatanga » Tue Dec 03, 2013 9:21 pm

To me there are just "rights". Any time there's a word put in front of "rights" that segregates a group of people such that their "rights" can be treated differently, then I have a problem.

Black rights
Gay rights
Trans-whatever rights
Women's rights

Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong. It's just "rights".

My mother-in-law amuses me by saying "I'm tired of hearing all these gays wanting special laws passed just for them". If there weren't special laws passed preventing them from doing things in the first place, there would be no need for them to have special laws passed for them now!
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Klaudandus » Tue Dec 03, 2013 9:35 pm

Pretty valid point.

It's just that some people just really stink it up for everyone else.
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Paxen » Tue Dec 03, 2013 11:54 pm

Koatanga wrote:My mother-in-law amuses me by saying "I'm tired of hearing all these gays wanting special laws passed just for them". If there weren't special laws passed preventing them from doing things in the first place, there would be no need for them to have special laws passed for them now!


Very important point. That's why I think that it doesn't matter that there's douchebags on both sides. It's obvious to me what the right side is anyway - I don't decide what's right and wrong based on my dislike for certain people. It's mostly the other way around.
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby fuzzygeek » Wed Dec 04, 2013 11:23 am

The correct approach is not to pass more laws. The correct approach is to repeal old laws.

There's the mindset that "whatever is not explicitly banned, is permitted," as opposed to "whatever is not explicitly permitted, is banned."

As a society I think we're better off with the first, but I see a lot of lawmakers with the mentality of the second.
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby KysenMurrin » Wed Dec 04, 2013 11:37 am

Not so clear-cut when it comes to enforcing non-discrimination, though. Sometimes special laws can be necessary, since a cultural change doesn't come about overnight, but can be helped along with legislation.

(And yes, then you get into those arguments about at what point the laws are no longer necessary.)
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Re: LGBT rights discussion

Postby Koatanga » Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:56 pm

fuzzygeek wrote:The correct approach is not to pass more laws. The correct approach is to repeal old laws.

There's the mindset that "whatever is not explicitly banned, is permitted," as opposed to "whatever is not explicitly permitted, is banned."

As a society I think we're better off with the first, but I see a lot of lawmakers with the mentality of the second.

That all depends on the law. If there is a law passed that says "marriage is between a man and a woman who are not directly related by blood", then if you repeal it some yahoo is going to marry a goat just to make the point that the law shouldn't have been repealed. If you pass a law amending the previous to read "two people" instead of "a man and a woman" then you don't have to deal with the yahoos so much.
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