Politics (formerly Election 2012)

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Re: Election 2012

Postby Thalia » Sun Oct 28, 2012 9:33 pm

Skye1013 wrote:
Thalia wrote:comments like yours take away the human faces behind those who actually "Pay" taxes.

Not exactly sure what you mean by this... just because I get a rebate each year when filing my taxes doesn't mean I'm not paying taxes.



By that I meant people who pay income taxes.

Anyway, i erased my comments, i need to come home to relax from not to argue on the internet, new rule for me.

Cheers
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Klaudandus » Sun Oct 28, 2012 9:41 pm

My beef is Romney saying that Obama made the economy worse
http://news.yahoo.com/romney-economy-ob ... ction.html

Obama was handed a shit sandwich by the Bush administration, and by most accounts the economy is improving and has not made any really bad decisions that have made things worse.

You could make a case that someone else would have done better, or that there is a recovery in spite of Obama. You cannot make a case that things are worse today than they were at this point in 2008 and expect to be taken remotely seriously
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Aubade » Sun Oct 28, 2012 9:44 pm

Thalia wrote:
Aubade wrote:What I fear is anyone who honestly 100% believes Mitt Romney will help the economy, or create more jobs. I don't see it happening at all.

EDIT: Actually, he WILL create new jobs. The top 1% of Taxpayers will need to hire more accountants to handle all the extra money they'll be rakin' in.



Wow as someone who benefits from those tax cuts and actually passes on the savings by having employed 4 people this year, and trying to hire more, i find that so ridiculous.

My parents are also self employed and had 10 employees now they are down to 5 because of how bad the economy is. And it's not like their industry is a luxury industry, they sell wholesale food to market.

I am not the top 1% but I am a business owner trying to make it to that 1% and find nothing wrong with keeping more of my money that I worked my ass off for. I am very generous and give my employees more hours than they need so they can pay for their school books, instead of cutting their hours to just what I need.

I am so tired of this unfair and ridiculous portrayal. You all think people who have money are all like Paris Hilton...don't forget that most of us have worked our asses off for it and sacrificed so much, comments like yours take away the human faces behind those who actually "Pay" taxes.


Maybe I painted with too broad of a brush-stroke here. When I talk about the 1% that are going to benefit from a Mitt Romney administration, I'm talking about the 1%. people who have 50 Million + In personal wealth. Maybe not even that low. I don't think that Mitt romney will help any person below that. I am ALL for small Business, and working hard to make it big. I have nothing against rich people who have worked hard for what they earn.

What gets me, is that Mitt Romney is "for small Business". When I think small business I think of a mom and pop shop, or a small 20-30 employee company or anywhere in-between. I myself work for a small business. I am a machinist programmer for a small shop owned by my grandfather, there are a grand total of 2 employee's here. Me, and 1 other guy. I know first-hand how hard it is for small business nowadays, we've had to cut-down on plans for expanding and I've personally taken a pay cut because of the fact that we're not making a profit. There is nothing in a Mitt Romney administration that would help me. Nothing that helps small business.

Have you seen any details on how he wants to "Help us"? As far as concrete FACTS that I know of that I can base my decisions on for Mitt Romney I have 2 things.

1. Mitt Romney has helped participate in outsourcing jobs through Bain Capitol. Now, the defense here is that he didn't personally do this, which I believe to be BS. but even if he didn't personally help, he did allow it to happen under his ownership.

2. A "Promise" To help me. No facts, no details, just a promise.


Obama:

1. I've seen jobs slowly coming back to the port of Tacoma, I've seen our local economy starting to grow again, stores opening up again.

2. I've seen my grandfathers business shut down during the worst of the recession (2008-2009) He opened up again in late 2009, and has been slowly getting more and more business since then. To the point where we're looking to hire 2-3 people next year, and expand out to buying another machine.

Now, I didn't mean to say that rich people don't work hard, or that they don't deserve what they've earned or even that they aren't generous people who care about the people they employ, because for every 1 douche bag employer rich cat there are hundreds of good honest hard-working people who have made some good money.

My point here is this. Obama's plans are working, his policies are starting to make a difference in the world that I can see with my own eyes.

As far as taxes go, multiple experts have stated time and time again, that Romney CANNOT promise the things that he is without raising taxes on the middle class. I won't bother linking them in this post because brekkie and the others have beaten this horse plenty enough and posted plenty of links proving this statement.

The way I see it is that Obama may not have the best direction on EVERYTHING. But for the majority of the important things he has a plan and is genuinely trying to help the american people and doing a decent job at it. Romney is setting a unheard-of bar of banking on the ignorance of the GOP voter-base and the hatred of Obama that has been created through media. Every time I see or read of Romney I hear some new fact that makes me disgusted with him that much more, and I truly believe that there has never been a politician more interested in lining his and his friend's pockets more than Romney.

I won't even get into the social issues that I completely disagree with him on, and the GOP's insistence on getting their religious agenda pushed through their party platforms. Although to be fair, I don't think that if elected Romney will do any of the social things in his party's platform.

For the Record: I am a conservative, registered republican voting for Obama.
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Skye1013 » Sun Oct 28, 2012 9:45 pm

Thalia wrote:
Skye1013 wrote:
Thalia wrote:comments like yours take away the human faces behind those who actually "Pay" taxes.

Not exactly sure what you mean by this... just because I get a rebate each year when filing my taxes doesn't mean I'm not paying taxes.



By that I meant people who pay income taxes.

Anyway, i erased my comments, i need to come home to relax from not to argue on the internet, new rule for me.

Cheers

Wasn't trying to argue, just trying to clarify. :)

Income taxes = the taxes that get pulled out of all of my paychecks, yes? I pay federal income taxes (Texas doesn't have state income taxes.) Hence the confusion.
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Klaudandus » Sun Oct 28, 2012 9:47 pm

Skye1013 wrote:Income taxes = the taxes that get pulled out of all of my paychecks, yes? I pay federal income taxes (Texas doesn't have state income taxes.) Hence the confusion.


Yup, one of the few things I like about Texas.
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Aubade » Sun Oct 28, 2012 9:47 pm

Also; I should clarify. When I say "he top 1% of Taxpayers will need to hire more accountants to handle all the extra money they'll be rakin' in."

I'm talking about the CEO's who do nothing but go to board meetings once a month, but get million dollar bonuses every quarter. I'm talking about Donald Trump, Goldman Sachs, Fat cat Bankers, The Koch Brothers. People who have more money than they could ever spend. These are the people who are paying too little taxes.
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Melathys » Sun Oct 28, 2012 10:53 pm

the best endorsement for Romney yet...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=p ... TiXUF9xbTo
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Re: Election 2012

Postby aureon » Mon Oct 29, 2012 1:34 am

Comments are even more hilarious:
He's not mocking republicans, he's mocking the gross overreaction of people to the result of an election. People on both sides always seem to think that if "the other candidate wins, our country will be plunged into mass chaos," which is laughable.

Yes, tell me more about both parties are the same and how Bush was the same as Gore!

Thalia, no one here ever dared attack the likes of you, the real small business owners.
The problem is, Romney's agenda (for the part that is known, atleast) does not include anything to help that category, despite his claims. He's the quantum politician, but lies HAVE to be called out by someone.
Mathematically impossible plans are lies, straight out. 5+2 doesn't make -2.
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Malthrax » Mon Oct 29, 2012 5:22 am

aureon wrote: 5+2 doesn't make -2.


You are, obviously, not a Certified Public Accountant.
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Shoju » Mon Oct 29, 2012 6:38 am

I had a romney supporter tell me that if Obamacare goes through, my wife could die because of the wait times for her doctor care because of her type 1 diabetes.

"It's a Chronic Condition, and that's where the cuts happen first. You will end up waiting months to see a doctor for it, and SHE COULD DIE."

SERIOUSLY?! I just... wow... yes. People will believe anything, and try to sucker you into believing their brain disease as well.
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Brekkie » Mon Oct 29, 2012 7:36 am

The latest XKCD was very interesting.

Did an excellent job of showing a graphical representation of how the Republican party has moved further and further far-right in recent decades, with moderates shrinking to extinction.

The effect of this election on the House of Representatives is probably what is going to be the biggest surprise this election. It is very hard to predict what will happen, both in terms of either party gaining and losing seats, and in terms of the ideological balance within each party.

The Presidential election is pretty likely to go to Obama, barring a major upset and all the polling numbers being wrong. Fivethirtyeight has him statistically plotted at something like 75% chance to win.

The Senate is similarly predictable, with Dems likely to retain their narrow majority with somewhere around 52-53 seats, give or take.

The House, nobody knows. The Republicans have a large enough majority that the odds are they will still have control, but that's just a guess. There are too many districts for polling to give a good picture of what will happen.
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Aubade » Mon Oct 29, 2012 7:47 am

Hmm, I think that's the first time I've ever made such a long political rant. /whew
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Klaudandus » Mon Oct 29, 2012 9:46 am

http://abcnews.go.com/politics/t/blogEntry?id=17583640
Gingrich thinks just about every catholic agrees that god hands out rape babies as if they were favors

*Disclaimer: It's monday, I got a headache and I feel really snarky...
Last edited by Klaudandus on Mon Oct 29, 2012 10:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Aubade » Mon Oct 29, 2012 10:05 am

Ugh why did I type so much >.> I feel like brekkie now that I re-read that. <3
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Shoju » Mon Oct 29, 2012 10:11 am

Since it's election based (even if sort of) ever since I said "Romen Noodles" when referring to Mittens, my kids call him nothing but "Romen Noodles" or "Mitten's Romen Noodles"

Oh the jokes that kids find funny.
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Aubade » Mon Oct 29, 2012 10:15 am

Oh god. I can just imagine him getting elected.

"Daddy, why is Mittens Romney noodles talking on the TV again"
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Malthrax » Mon Oct 29, 2012 11:17 am

“If you were looking for a bunch of partisan rhetoric, I’m probably not your guy.”

“If you can’t beat your opponent’s ideas, you distort those ideas — maybe you just make some up. If you don’t have a record to run on, then you paint your opponent as somebody people should run away from. You make big elections about small things.”

“We have to get to the point where we can have a conversation about big important issues that matter to the American people without vitriol, without name calling, without the assumptions of the worst in other people’s motives.”
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Klaudandus » Mon Oct 29, 2012 12:50 pm

http://www.theatlantic.com/business/arc ... ny/260006/
So... uh... why do the 1% need a tax cut again?
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Shoju » Mon Oct 29, 2012 12:59 pm

Klaudandus wrote:http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2012/07/the-5-trillion-stash-us-corporations-money-hoard-is-bigger-than-the-gdp-of-germany/260006/
So... uh... why do the 1% need a tax cut again?


Because they're worth it baby!

No?

Uh.... Because they tire of donating half of their income to charity so that they don't have to pay taxes?
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Melathys » Mon Oct 29, 2012 7:31 pm

I think one of the things bugging me most about this election are the people who hated Romney with every fiber of their being during the primaries are now singing his praises.

I'm a lifelong Republican, but I find that I would rather vote for Obama than Romney. But I'm not voting for either, I'm voting for Johnson.
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Skye1013 » Mon Oct 29, 2012 8:06 pm

Melathys wrote:I'm a lifelong Republican, but I find that I would rather vote for Obama than Romney. But I'm not voting for either, I'm voting for Johnson.

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Re: Election 2012

Postby tinalt » Mon Oct 29, 2012 9:41 pm

Melathys wrote:I think one of the things bugging me most about this election are the people who hated Romney with every fiber of their being during the primaries are now singing his praises.

I'm a lifelong Republican, but I find that I would rather vote for Obama than Romney. But I'm not voting for either, I'm voting for Johnson.


They're singing his praises now because of one simple fact. He's going up against Obama. The republican party has spent the past 4 years doing everything in it's power to stonewall the Obama administration, catch them in some sort of scandal, and generally throw a giant freaking tantrum.

It's the reason why congress has even more incompetent than normal (and that's saying something) the past 4 years. They've been too busy fighting Obama tooth and nail to get anything done.

Honestly, you could take a caricature of the most evil, greedy, robber baron from one of the old 1930's political cartoons and make him the republican candidate. He'd still have half (or more) of the republican party lining up to vote for him for one simple reason. He's not Obama. Hell, you could make the empty chair that Clint Eastwood addressed at the republican national convention the nominee and they'd still vote for it. Because it's not Obama.
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Skye1013 » Mon Oct 29, 2012 9:58 pm

A side of abortion that people don't appear to consider all that much.

http://us.cnn.com/2012/10/29/opinion/fr ... index.html
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Shoju » Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:33 am

Skye1013 wrote:A side of abortion that people don't appear to consider all that much.

http://us.cnn.com/2012/10/29/opinion/fr ... index.html


That is truly a fantastic article. I read it yesterday on a link from a friends FB, and thought it was pretty interesting.
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Re: Election 2012

Postby Klaudandus » Tue Oct 30, 2012 7:43 am

Too bad its socialism~!
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