Fitness and being Healthy

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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby cdan » Wed Oct 09, 2013 10:11 am

Nothing faddy about getting off wheat.
Getting off supermarket bread and mass market pastas and other mass market products made with flour are usually what people mean when they are getting off wheat. That is a good thing in the USA especially because of all the crap added to cheap flour. Which also has a lot of the good stuff taken out perversely enough. They also add in extra Gluten which, in larger amounts than were traditionally found in flour, etc. 501-00 years ago, can cause all sorts of digestive problems.

Cutting out a significant amount of mass market wheat is a bloody good idea.

Bake your own bread with decent flour that has not been processed to death and look for pasta brands that have ingredients lists that are not twenty lines long.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Sabindeus » Wed Oct 09, 2013 11:47 am

Amirya wrote:Why not just slice up the fruit and shove it in the freezer?

effort?
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Nikachelle » Wed Oct 09, 2013 12:40 pm

So I was like "I want a leather jacket because the one I have is old and... well basically I just want one."

So I go to the store and am asking about a particular jacket and the woman is like "Do you know what size you are? A medium or a... (she literally paused and eyeballed me up and down) or a large?" Thanks lady, I feel fabulous now. So I told her my previous jacket was a medium. AND THEN I WENT OVER TO THE RACK AND PUT ON A SIZE SMALL AND IT FIT PERFECTLY AND SHE WAS LIKE OKAY I GUESS YOU'RE A SMALL.

Damn did I ever feel vindicated.

/dance
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby KysenMurrin » Wed Oct 09, 2013 12:51 pm

Ha ha, nice.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Fridmarr » Wed Oct 09, 2013 4:12 pm

cdan wrote:Nothing faddy about getting off wheat.
Getting off supermarket bread and mass market pastas and other mass market products made with flour are usually what people mean when they are getting off wheat. That is a good thing in the USA especially because of all the crap added to cheap flour. Which also has a lot of the good stuff taken out perversely enough. They also add in extra Gluten which, in larger amounts than were traditionally found in flour, etc. 501-00 years ago, can cause all sorts of digestive problems.

Cutting out a significant amount of mass market wheat is a bloody good idea.

Bake your own bread with decent flour that has not been processed to death and look for pasta brands that have ingredients lists that are not twenty lines long.

While I agree that the more refined flours aren't good for you, there's no real difference between mass market products made with flour, and the all-purpose flour people have at home. Basically, you want to eat products made with whole grain/whole wheat flour instead of the refined stuff which is often called just flour, white flour, or enriched flour. That holds whether it is store bought or you made it at home.

Also, gluten is actually added when making bread from the whole grain stuff. It's added create a better texture for the bread because all the extra fiber would make it very dense without that added rubbery protein. It's usually called vital wheat gluten, and pretty much any bread recipe with whole grain flour will require it. It's generally only a problem if you are sensitive to it.

I second the idea of making your own bread, it sounds like a pain, but with today's breadmakers it's really easy.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Nooska » Thu Oct 10, 2013 1:53 am

Homemade bread is also really really tasty.
Especially if using a sour dough recipe (it takes a bit of rpeparation to get teh sour dough, but ionce its there, you juust need to feed it and care for a it a bit - its a less demanding pet ;))

Using organic yeast and organic tipo 00 flour and a pinch of salt I made the tasties ciabatta bread I've ever had a few weeks ago. This is one of thos eplaces where organic really does make a difference, as there are more bacteria (the good kind) that can devolop more lactic acid in the leavening - especially with pre-doughs.

(The bad part of making ones own bread is - you need someone to eat it or you jsut end up ODing on calories to eat the tasty tasty bread :))
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Fivelives » Thu Oct 10, 2013 2:08 am

Gluten is a protein formed when wheat proteins (specifically glutenin and gliadin) are combined with water. That's why the current trend of gluten-free uses rice flour instead, along with almond flour and other sorts of flour substitutes (generally just powder anything that contains enough carbohydrates in it and you'll get a "flour substitute").

Fun fact, "celiac disease" (intolerance to gluten) is almost unknown outside the US, and it's almost completely absent (outside US run clinics) in third world shitholes who don't get to eat anything on a daily basis, let alone baked bread. The only starving kids that get celiac disease in third world countries are those that go to charity clinics run by US charitable organizations.

Which makes me doubt that it's Really Even A Thing. Remember folks, there used to be studies and literature that supported prophylactic tonsilectomies, then prophylactic ear tubes, etc. Today's bogeyman in the closet seems, at least to me, to be celiac disease. And my evidence is that the only places it's even noted are industrialized nations with a developed medical industry.

So I call bullshit on the whole "going wheat free" thing. Because it quite frankly is a bullshit fad. Eating a balanced diet with regulated portion control will ALWAYS be healthier than any starvation diet fad. Even if pseudoscientists want to convince you otherwise.

I'm fine with storebought bread, personally. Sure, baking your own sounds like it's so much better, but really the only difference between baking your own bread and buying bread at the store (either from the bakery or a distributor) is that you won't add anything that keeps your bread from going stale. They're called bread conditioners, and unless you want to eat your entire loaf of bread in a day - or bake a lot of bread pudding - it's better to either add your own bread conditioners (thus making your homebaked alternative bread exactly the same as commercial) or just buy commercial in the first place.

TL;DR: Celiac disease is bullshit, storebought bread is just fine, portion control and a balanced diet will ALWAYS be better than a starvation fad diet that removes anything from the proverbial shelves as far as what you can and can't eat.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Fridmarr » Thu Oct 10, 2013 5:59 am

Well the other difference is taste. Homemade can be customized to your tastes.

Conditioners and preservatives aren't necessarily the same thing. Homemade bread, properly stored, will last 4-5 days and it can be frozen. I don't have a problem with store bought bread either, just read the labels and you'll find some breads that use only whole grain flours.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby cdan » Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:27 am

BRB, got to go and tell my sister-in-law the geneticist that she is a pseudoscientist. Will certainly come as a surprise to her.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Nooska » Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:29 am

We have some pretty good labels that can be put on food around here.
The wholegrain label
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(Choose wholegrain first)
This label (for bread) means that at least 50 % of the dry stuff in it is wholegrain.
Additionally there requirements to the contents of fat, sugar, sodium and fibre.

There is the other mark called the Keyhole label;
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The Keyhole can be placed on food that meets requirements in regards to fibre, fat, sugar and salt. Candy, ice cream, soda etc cannot get the label.

The wholegrain label cannot be gotten without also meeting the requirements for the keyhole.

I still check the actual contents of a product, but using labels like these can help people to actually buy healthier produts, without having to understand the content label.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby firstamendme » Fri Oct 11, 2013 5:20 am

So minor victory I suppose. I went to a dietitian about 6 weeks ago and he told me that to lose fat and tone up (and just be generally healthier) I should add about 1000 calories to my daily intake (bringing it up to 4000). To make sense of my problem with this, one would first need to know that I was obese for the first ~18 years of my life and finally lost 160lbs right before starting undergrad. Since then, I'm super paranoid about gaining weight and tend to freak out that I'm eating too much all the time.

Hearing that I needed to eat that much more freaked me out, and it took me 3 weeks to actually force myself to start doing it. Since then, I've noted a huge increase in energy and endurance and have actually lost ~2% body fat after eating more. It's still difficult for me to accept even with the results, and when I go to eat I sometimes freak out a bit. I found that putting everything into excel and breaking down the numbers helps me to sit down and just think of it in terms of "I'm just meeting the doctors required numbers for these categories". I'm not sure if my mental state will ever change, but at least I'm eating the right amount! (It's 4000 calories of nutrient dense foods, whole grains, lots of protein and low fat dairy, and a ton of veggies and fruit).

Now I just have to keep overcoming my self imposed stigma against eating and keep at it. :P
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Fridmarr » Fri Oct 11, 2013 6:04 am

That's awesome. To be honest, I don't think I'd be able to eat 4k calories without resorting to junk food or gainer shakes. I just don't have the appetite anymore that I did in my 20s.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby firstamendme » Fri Oct 11, 2013 6:16 am

Thanks! If you count racquetball (typically a 1-2 hour session) I exercise about 10 times a week and am very active while in my lab during the day. That helps the appetite, but I've definitely had to add things like protein bars (300 calories a pop) and very dense foods to hit 4k. Also things like making my protein shakes with milk instead of water helps. Additionally I've come to discover that "Family Packs" of lean chicken breasts are grossly mislabeled :p. It feels like I'm always eating, but it's doable. The thing to really get used to is eating while drinking the massive amount of water recommended while on a high protein diet. Sometimes I just feel a little sloshy.

The one thing I've noticed that really buggers me up is drinking alcohol. I've noticed that drinking (typically bourbon) destroys my appetite the next day and makes it hard to maintain the inflated caloric values.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Nikachelle » Fri Oct 11, 2013 6:19 am

Wow that's amazing. And kudos do your dietitian to tell you to eat more (even if it is 4k calories... holy crud). I hear all too often that doctor order their patients to eat far too few calories which generally results in more problems.

And holy shit you lost 160 pounds? That's amazing!
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby firstamendme » Fri Oct 11, 2013 6:40 am

Nikachelle wrote:Wow that's amazing. And kudos do your dietitian to tell you to eat more (even if it is 4k calories... holy crud). I hear all too often that doctor order their patients to eat far too few calories which generally results in more problems.


The number is that high because of my super high activity level along with being 6'4, 240lbs with 7% body fat, and large framed. Psychologically i still have to fight the desire to only eat 1200, which is dangerously low for someone my size.

Nikachelle wrote:And holy shit you lost 160 pounds? That's amazing!


Not so amazing the way I did it. It was a form of bulimia (I didn't know that at the time) where the purging is exercise instead of vomiting. I would eat 1100 calories a day and burn 1900-2000 per day through exercise. I looked like a concentration camp survivor at the end. Luckily I was 17 years old so my body didn't suffer any permanent damage through such rapid (~11 months) loss and abuse.


Edit: The purge part comes into play in that if I ate 100 extra calories one day, I would figure out the exact amount of exercise I would need to do to counter it and add it on.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Fridmarr » Fri Oct 11, 2013 7:03 am

firstamendme wrote:The one thing I've noticed that really buggers me up is drinking alcohol. I've noticed that drinking (typically bourbon) destroys my appetite the next day and makes it hard to maintain the inflated caloric values.

Oh bummer, I would have thought that alcoholic drinks would be a help given their caloric density. I wonder if that's a common response at normal calorie consumption (I'm guessing not, or some idiot would have invented the "bourbon diet") or if it's a byproduct of your elevated levels.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby firstamendme » Fri Oct 11, 2013 8:34 am

In terms of raw calories I suppose that's true, but I try to hit the number using more nutrient rich options.

I suppose I should specify that when I drink the bourbon and feel the appetite suppression I've probably had anywhere between 8-15 shots worth of it. The only ill after effect I experience the next day is the lack of appetite. It would be an interesting study to see the effect of alcohol on the appetite of people of varying intakes and activity levels since there seems to be a great deal of variance if one is to listen to personal anecdotes.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Sabindeus » Fri Oct 11, 2013 9:44 am

firstamendme wrote:Not so amazing the way I did it. It was a form of bulimia (I didn't know that at the time) where the purging is exercise instead of vomiting. I would eat 1100 calories a day and burn 1900-2000 per day through exercise. I looked like a concentration camp survivor at the end. Luckily I was 17 years old so my body didn't suffer any permanent damage through such rapid (~11 months) loss and abuse.


I dunno dude that sounds pretty amazing to me. I wish I could have done that when I was 17.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Fivelives » Fri Oct 11, 2013 11:40 am

Fridmarr wrote:Well the other difference is taste. Homemade can be customized to your tastes.

Conditioners and preservatives aren't necessarily the same thing. Homemade bread, properly stored, will last 4-5 days and it can be frozen. I don't have a problem with store bought bread either, just read the labels and you'll find some breads that use only whole grain flours.


Bread generally doesn't have preservatives added to it. They add conditioners to keep it from going stale, and the seal on a bread bag is surprisingly good for how simple it is. If a preservative is added, it's usually something like cultured wheat starch or cultured whey. It's cheaper to use those, as they're byproducts of bread production to begin with - cultured wheat starch is basically just dried sourdough, for example.

I've always found that freezing and refrigerating bread makes it go stale faster. Probably because the cold temperature hardens the protein (like what happens after cooked rice gets cold) and forces the water to migrate out. I'm not entirely sure why though, and it could just be purely anecdotal on my part.

As far as taste is concerned, that's a good reason for preferring your own bread. Whenever I've got the time to do any serious home cooking, I generally make my own dinner rolls and suchnot. I prefer storebought for the convenience though.

I'm a sucker for sourdough bread. So I don't generally buy many whole grain breads - other than rye breads for sandwiches (I prefer the darker rye breads for my sandwiches, and sourdough for toast and grilled sandwiches). Nothing wrong with either choice really (enriched flour breads vs whole grain flour breads), especially not in moderation. So buy - or bake - whatever tastes best for you.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Fridmarr » Fri Oct 11, 2013 1:41 pm

Conditioners are designed to keep the texture of the bread consistent longer, in other words they fight off going stale.  Preservatives will generally inhibit mold growth.  Depending on the bread manufacturer, some of either can be added, and some things fall in both categories.  They aren't adding HFCS to feed the yeast...
 
I don't think anyone said anything about refridgerating bread, and with good reason, because it will make your bread go stale faster.  As I said though, freezing is just fine if you need it to last awhile.  You can also generally freeze the dough if you make extra and want to save it for later.
 
There absolutely is a considerable difference between bread made with only enriched white flour and bread made from only whole grain flour.  Enriched flour bread is basically pure starch as by comparison it contains more carbs, less (if any) fiber, and less protein, and so you get an appropriate glycemic response.  You should almost treat it in the same vein as sugar. 
 
The higher fiber and protein in whole grain bread staves off the insulin rush and increases the satiety of the bread.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Nikachelle » Sat Oct 12, 2013 9:13 am

I'm in Ottawa for Thanksgiving and went to the YMCA (my gym) here for some lifting while on holidays.

HOLY SHIT THEY HAVE DEADLIFT PLATFORMS AND LOAAAAAAADS OF SQUAT RACKS AND NO ONE IS USING THEM.

Was heavenly.

AND, they had like... massive weights for the deadlift bars so that even though the weight is lower, the size of the weight is big enough that you can do proper movement without overextending. WAS AMAZING. And for the first time ever, deadlifts felt normal. Man, I wish they had these at the one in downtown Toronto that I go to... but there's really no space for these things.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Fridmarr » Tue Oct 15, 2013 4:02 pm

Was just filling out my worksheet for my next four weeks of workouts, and I realized that if I'm able to hit all the weight increments, I'll be in personal best territory for everything but bench (and I'm unlikely to ever see a personal best on bench again anyhow). On one side that keeps the motivation high for now, but if it becomes a struggle I know I'll have to work hard to stay motivated through the disappointment. Either way though, it was a proud moment to realize those goals are in sight.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Nooska » Wed Oct 16, 2013 10:13 am

Just popping into this thread to say...
Walking is really something that can give you a high feeling.

We went for a walk on the medium/short lenght clover trail (a concept they've put out with marked trails in 4 lengths around a central hun in som of our suburbia) on sunday - just to get some air, since we didn't have anything to do - that was a nice walk of roughly 5 miles through some rain, but a lot of dryness while walking through the forest.
When home we felt pretty used, but also quite well off.

Monday the GF wanted to go to the bakery for some scones and a cinnamonstick (danish pastry), since we had been good and exercised on sunday I said okay. After getting home we got a text that the book she reserve off a library in the other end of the country had come home, she wanted to go pick that up, so we did. On the way home I suggested (jokingly) that we could extend the walk by going past our place and down and take a stroll around the (small) lake thats nearby - she said okay. I thought I'd push it a bit, and said, we could also circle it twice (the path around the lake itself is about half a mile) - she one-upped me and suggested we instead walk down to where our local petstore moved to (round trip thats just over 3 miles) - I said okay, but I wanted to go into the 'hardware' store to buy some preserve jars (for keeping my honey cake starter in for the month it has to sit), not far out of the way, just about another half mile on it. Going home we went the full circle around the lake (we pass by part of it when going to the pet store).
Safely home I check and we've walked around 6½ miles at this point.
I check my recipe and realize I don't have any organic wheat flour (for honeycakes I want organic) - so I ask if we can go get some, GF says 'yes, but where do you want to get it' - I reply with a 'specialty' supermarket thats in the mall we usually walk to around 3 times per week - she looks at me and asks if I'm kidding (round trip 3 miles), I say no, then she replies, okay, but then I want to eat at KFC on the way home - sure I say (knowing how many calories we've burned off by walking already, and that we often eat there on the way home, as the walk back and forth make the calorie count of it about the same net as a light lunch staying home.
While walking home I joke that I want to take an evening walk as well, something she rejects, but I still manage to convince her later, so we take another walk down to the lake and twice around.
Adding up when back home, I can tally up 11½ miles walked on monday.

Tuesday we have an 'appointment' to go to "dyrehaven" - a large animal reservation (basically), established by one of the kings of old as a private hunting ground (presently its one of the largest areas where we can see (semi-)wild sika deer, fallow deer and red deer (called "Crown deer - historically it was the prerogative of the crown to hunt red deer) - it being mating season it is a very visited area. Walking to borrow the car (to drive there), walking around out there and walking back after returning the car, tallied up to 6½ miles.

We decided yesterday to go buy some proper walking shoes for the GF, as she got blisters from walking so much in her shoes (they were never meant for walking so much). So we walk to our 'local' mall and buy thenm, then we decide to walk out to another mall where we have a blockbuster subscription, to return a BD for another (and 'reward' ourselves with some bread/cake from the local Lidl (they have bake-off, so its pretty fresh, and very cheap) - we did end up taking the train home due to sore legs and feet on the part of the GF, not that I can blame her in any way, tallying up todays 6 miles, we've walked 29 miles over the past 4 days, and not once has ourgeneral fitness said stop, just soreness from not being used to doing it so much.

The funny thing is I don't think I would have had any problem walking home instead of taking the train, adding another 2 miles (the way back minus the way from the train station and home).

Walking is such a high - we've agreed to take it a bit easy tomorrow and friday so she can break in her new shoes, so likely we won't do anything more than the sunday walk, big question is if we can keep it to that (the feeling after the long walk on monday was awesome - tired, but awesome).
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Sabindeus » Thu Oct 17, 2013 2:53 pm

Walking usually gives me a sweaty feeling rather than a high feeling.
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Re: Fitness and being Healthy

Postby Sabindeus » Thu Oct 17, 2013 2:54 pm

http://lifehacker.com/standing-for-3-ho ... 1447078889

I've been really bad about using my standing desk, I think I need to set up a notification to remind me to stop sitting down every so often.
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