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How much unbuffed health is needed to fight Naj'entus?

Naj'entus, Supremus, Akama, Gorefiend, Gurtogg Bloodboil, RoS, Sharaz, Council, Illidan

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How much unbuffed health is needed to fight Naj'entus?

Postby superworm » Sat May 24, 2008 10:10 am

Currently my guild is 4/5 in Mount Hyjal so our RL decided to try BT. However we wiped disastrously for two nights (well not two full nights but we stopped trying after all the entrance mobs had refreshed).
The best time we got him to 24%, at which point he berserked and wiped us. The problem is before the shield breaks, there are those hit by needle spine and as we are separated by groups, usually only the assigned group healer is healing them which seems just not enough.
Is it necessary to stack the health high enough to eat a needle spine AND a tidal shield and still be able to survive?

And I think our positioning is also making some trouble.
We have four ranged groups, two on the left hand side of the MT and two on the right (the MT is facing the boss) and both two groups are separated by the pillars in the room. Generally different groups have no LoS each other because I can only heal my own group and the MT/rougues in the center.. Don't know exactly why. And sometimes I even can't heal the mage in my group just behind me who is standing on some upper place (can't describe that exactly but their positions are those along the wall which is somewhat higher than the place in the center with water on it ). Also I constantly get the splash damage from the needle spine but we should be 6 yards away from each other.


I think there must be something terribly wrong. It is said BT 1~3 are easy and we could one-shot MH 1~4, but we wiped miserably here.

Should we use some high stamina equipment or change our positioning? And at the most how many melees could you have in this fight? Our rogues are complaining about constantly being splashed when we have four melees excluding the MT.

Is it really because our healers suck? We even asked the two SPs in the raid to heal but still we had no luck.

Any suggestions?
Last edited by superworm on Sat May 24, 2008 10:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Lieris » Sat May 24, 2008 10:28 am

I know very little about healing but here 10K raid buffed is the minimum HP really when learning the fight. Priests/mages should have replaced their low stamina craftables by now.

That said I don't think it's impossible though to survive the tidal shield and a spine though without any heals in between. Healers should be healing the raid quicker and peeps should use HS, pots etc.
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Postby Worldie » Sat May 24, 2008 7:42 pm

Everyone must have between 9 and 10k HP, with 10k+ being ideal.

Priests and mage can live with just 8k if they shield themselves when teh bubble is up.
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Postby Seloei » Sun May 25, 2008 4:19 pm

Najentus is horrid on healing, since the splash damage is huge.
The way we do him is everyone spreads out into an even "grid" of sorts where the 6 mob pack was and everyone heals everyone. Chain heal is godlike here. The less people bunched together the easier it is to keep everyone up and err...
This is more or less an "awakeness check" fight, as your life is in the hands of the person next to you. Healers can keep you up for a while with the spine in you, but unless the other persons near you don't take out the spine, your dead meat. When you can get the positsioning down (plenty of different ways for that) and people are focusing enough to grab the spines, he isn't so tought.
If he berserked on 24% that means either you don't have the dps for him (doubt it, your at 4/5 mh?) or you waited too long to top off everyone before tidal shield came up and had him heal up a lot. Try to keep everyone at max health as soon as possible and have fun :)
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Postby superworm » Sun May 25, 2008 11:39 pm

Seloei wrote:Najentus is horrid on healing, since the splash damage is huge.
The way we do him is everyone spreads out into an even "grid" of sorts where the 6 mob pack was and everyone heals everyone. Chain heal is godlike here. The less people bunched together the easier it is to keep everyone up and err...
This is more or less an "awakeness check" fight, as your life is in the hands of the person next to you. Healers can keep you up for a while with the spine in you, but unless the other persons near you don't take out the spine, your dead meat. When you can get the positsioning down (plenty of different ways for that) and people are focusing enough to grab the spines, he isn't so tought.
If he berserked on 24% that means either you don't have the dps for him (doubt it, your at 4/5 mh?) or you waited too long to top off everyone before tidal shield came up and had him heal up a lot. Try to keep everyone at max health as soon as possible and have fun :)


Yeah I'm also thinking that our wipe results more from the bad positioning. I checked that the one with the least health was a a priest who was around 9.3k raid buffed. Maybe we should pull the boss to the place with no pillars.
About the 24%, too many dpsers died and eventually only some healers and the MT and less than 3 dpsers were fighting :?
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Postby Skeezy » Mon May 26, 2008 1:17 am

CoH and chain heal GOOOOOOOOOOO.

I think there is a Naj assist mod as well that comes with Bigwigs/DBM that lets you know who has too low of HP to survive poping the bubble.

If it is taking awhile to heal up and pop the bubble, if you have a ms warrior, or have rogues use wound poison. I think both lower the heals he recieves while bubbled.
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Postby Snake-Aes » Mon May 26, 2008 5:02 am

The proximity window from boss mods isn't all good here since you're supposed to stack up a little bit.
It's much easier when someone on vent is calling the spike throws, call it as soon as everyone is on full health. Losing time is bad, he regens like 1% per second. It's a healer check and attention check mostly.
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Postby Therem » Fri May 30, 2008 1:35 am

We have people assigned to pull out the spikes in their area. This eliminates the danger of two people waiting for the other one to pull the spike.
As a healer, you have to be somewhat flexible. Try to position the raid so that LoS is not too much of an issue, so that healers can help out in other groups if necessary.

In general, I'm not a big fan of saying "Boss X is easy". A lot depends on your setup. Also, there's always the question easy compared to what?
In my opinion, compared to Vashj and Kael almost every Boss in MH/BT is easy, even Archimonde.
Ok, Winterchill and Akama are easy, these are a joke. Naj'entus and Supremus are just "not as hard as you'd expect" :).
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Postby ulushnar » Fri May 30, 2008 1:40 am

We tell folks to aim for 10k buffed on Naj. We also have most of the dps and healers grouped up in pairs so that there's always someone near to pull a spine, but not too much splash damage as a result of the spines.

It's a difficult boss for a starting group though. We've killed him four times now, some times it can take 4-5 attempts and some times we one-shot him, depending on how focussed the group is.
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Postby Seloei » Fri May 30, 2008 1:43 am

Progression killing is never easy, but once you have the fight down then compared to other bosses you have on "farm status" Najentus is easy. As long as everyone is doing what they are supposed to do (varies on tacs used) he is doable and after a dozen tries he will become easy.

As for spikes, we just have everyone watching around them and pull it out as soon as you can, Bigwigs marks em with a skull so quite easy to spot unless you are max zoomed in and only looking at your cooldowns. T6 content is "much easier" to learn than say... Vashj+Kael. The randomness factor has been reduced by a lot and only a few bosses are like that.
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Postby superworm » Tue Jun 03, 2008 2:59 am

Anyway, our RL has decided to put Archimonde before any BT boss. Maybe later I will bring good news.
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Postby Exalt » Tue Jun 03, 2008 7:07 am

Archi is harder than the first bosses in BT... way... way... way harder.

One thing my group found with Naj'entus was that sometimes it's better to take MORE splash damage in order to make healing easier.

We have a resto shaman in a group with a holy priest and spriest, flaked out behind the melee group. The holy priest uses prayer of healing on the group after bubble-pops and the resto shaman takes care of the melee group.

The three remaining groups all have a holy priest in with them for prayer of healing after the bubbles, and everyone stays *relatively* clumped up. Close enough to get spines quickly and be in range of PoH, but far enough away to avoid dropping too much splash damage on the group when they get hit.

We tried various other strats (even separation and buddy system) and the one we use now worked best for us.

The hard parts about the fight are:
-arranging your raid to take advantage of your healer setup
-having everyone react quickly to the spines
-NOT jumping the gun on breaking the bubble, take an extra second or two to top people up and get the healers to start going nuts 2-5 seconds before the shield goes up



The main thing is, don't be gun-shy. My raid was after our first night in there. 4 BT nights later and we're 3/9 and have had Teron down to 2%.
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Postby superworm » Fri Jun 06, 2008 9:40 am

We downed Naj last night. With better positioning and less melee dpsers he was not that hard.
The kill was quite coincident I must say. We had planned to kill Kael, but some key members was not online, so our RL decided to go farming BT trash mobs for trash drops (rings, gems, etc.). When we got to Naj, there were some more lv 70s online. Though they were mainly in blues, we decided to invite them to try Naj. Then we downed him. It's quite funny.
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Postby Heironeous » Fri Jun 06, 2008 10:43 am

We take priests and frost mages that only have 8600. Haven't had em die yet. Druids dont need that much HP either if they think to go outta form and hit bark-skin. The only people we want to pack in the HP is melee since they get packed in so tight for the smaller AOEs that 1 spine and a couble explosions will kill em fast with only passable health.

Good luck on the big blue demon!
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Postby Exalt » Fri Jun 06, 2008 10:54 am

One thing that we've found in our attempts is that those with less than 8500 unbuffed hp MUST call for kings/fort if they are battle rezzed during the fight. It's happened once or twice where we saw someone's name on the dbm/bigwigs pane that shows who is <8500hp while waiting for a bubble to pop, only to realize that they were at 100% hp and had just been BR'd.
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