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Min Req for heroics?

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Min Req for heroics?

Postby Snoogle » Fri Mar 28, 2008 9:14 pm

So I tried to tank a heroic instance today.. did not work out the well >.>
Priest with +1600 healing couldn't keep me up against 3 mobs >.>

Str: 189
Agility: 98
Stamina: 803
Int: 148
Armor: 11006

Def: 490
Dodge 16.53%
Parry 15.72%
Block(with holy shield) 42.62%

Spell damage 172

I'm not uncrushable but that shouldn't matter on trash, right?
I need some serious advice on what I should be looking to improve on. Any suggestions?

Assuming it updated:
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-shee ... ooglemunch
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Postby Aeverius » Fri Mar 28, 2008 9:46 pm

Hm. I could make a few suggestions, but looking at your gear overall, you seem to have a solid understanding of what you should be itemizing for. You don't need me to tell you to gem that chest with some solid stars, for instance. Your HP/avoidance is a bit low for what I'd want going into heroics, but you're at an acceptable level, certainly.

Uncrushable doesn't matter in 5-mans, period- it's just that if you are, you've got pretty nice avoidance going. Nothing in a heroic is going to crush you.

Now, my question: What instance, and what mobs? If you were trying to pull three Arcane Destroyers in the beginning of Mech, for instance, I'll just tell you not to do that anymore (they hit pretty hard, and you don't need to tank them like that anyway). If we're talking about something like the first pull of Ramps, that's a bit different. Use some CC if you have to, or make smaller pulls- whatever you need to get hit less.
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Postby Snoogle » Fri Mar 28, 2008 10:59 pm

UB, those elementals that come in 2s + 1healer

My guild has been coaxing me to get geared for tanking in Kara but I having a hell of a time get the right gear for it. No body runs dungeons in my server anymore >.>
Uncrushability is a concern of mine i guess, but it wouldn't hurt to have a separate stam/avoidance set for heroics

Next Q:
Other then this gear guide, is there anything I should look forward to in Heroic Drops other then badge rewards?
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Postby Gimorth » Tue Apr 01, 2008 5:44 am

Snoogle wrote:UB, those elementals that come in 2s + 1healer

My guild has been coaxing me to get geared for tanking in Kara but I having a hell of a time get the right gear for it. No body runs dungeons in my server anymore >.>
Uncrushability is a concern of mine i guess, but it wouldn't hurt to have a separate stam/avoidance set for heroics

Next Q:
Other then this gear guide, is there anything I should look forward to in Heroic Drops other then badge rewards?


It's funny. I was looking at your gear and wondering why (given that most of your gear was at least the right place to start) your HP pool is as low as it is. Then it hit me. None of your gear is enchanted. You are leaving alot of stamina on the table (as well as 40 Spell Damage) by not properly enchanting your gear.

Right now, Stamina is your enemy in heroics. Aside from the fact that your relatively low HP pool will make it hard to AoE tank most pulls, the biggest problem is that you are entering instances where most healers simply assume that the whole place will be trivial. (Everyone has done it eith fully over-geared toons for so long that it is quite a rude awakening when someone who actually needs some gear from the place zones in.)

DOn't be afraid to ask for CC. Make sure your DPS knows the proper kill order and make sure your healer is on his/her toes on those nasty pulls. If you can banish one of those elementals, do so. If you can't, you have to find another way to take one outof the equation while making sure the healing one is burned down quickly.

Finally, some of your talent choices are questionable.

+5% crit from conviction is useless
You need all the armor you can get at this point, and having only 2/5 Toughness leaves alot of armor on the table.
If the intention is to run heroics, reckoning versus 1H weapon specialization is kind of a matter of preference. However, I personally feel that the good parts of 1H Spec (+5% damage to Holy Shield, +5% to Ret Aura, +5% to Consecration, etc) outweigh the good parts of Reckoning.

For gear, I would see about trying to get a nice Stamina trinket (either the Argussian Compass (Heroic UB, ironically) or the Darkmoon Card), get another ring to replace andormu's tear as your heroic ring (all the avoidance is nice, but not really your problem for tanking heroic trash) and you should be in pretty good shape.
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Postby Moses » Sun Apr 06, 2008 4:47 am

Yeah, my stats looked something like that when I first tanked heroics. Group makeup plays a big part in it. If you have really fast dps then one mob can be down before the HoJ wears off. Also rogues opening with cheap shot can really cut down on the incoming damage when you first get the pull. So don't be afraid to ask for it, or sheeps, or seduces or any other kind of CC/stun that could help you.

170 spell damage seems a little low though. Make sure you use superior wizard oil and some +dam food. That sould but you up like 55 more spell damage which is really good.

Enchants, yeah you should really try to get some of your stuff enchanted. Enchants go a long way, so far that I even take the mats for the enchants I'll need with me when I go on raids, then I can use an upgrade instantly.

If your guild is regularly running kara I'd recommend getting a guild group together. There are people that will leave a PuG heroic after a few wipes and I'm sure that wouldn't help your confidence. You will probably make mistakes in the learning phase of each dungeon but everyone does.

For instance never having to worry about using HoJ on coilfang defenders in normal mode I found myself taking a lot of damage from them in heroic. So I used my favorite tactic for cutting the inc damage, stun one of them..... unfortunately that shield they put up... well it reflects HoJ... so yeah i wiped us.

Anyway my point is that I think it'd be best to learn the heroics with your friends. They will probably have more fun with it and be more forgiving of your mistakes. Sure you might be the butt of a few jokes for a bit, but everyone likes to laugh right =)
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Re: Min Req for heroics?

Postby Woden » Mon Apr 07, 2008 6:59 pm

Get a bit more health by enchanting some of your gear (18sta meta gem, gloves 10 sta, shield 18 sta, boots 12 sta, chest 150hp, those are fairly cheap, 20 sta from food).

While being uncrushable doesn't really matter in heroics, you only have 480 defense rating. Which means you are not immune to crits in heroics (you need 485).

Make sure the mobs aren't attacking your back, use hammer of justice if you get low.

Start out with an easy heroic first. My first heroic was slave pens and then mechanar. But it's only because I knew them well (done them on my rogue billion times) and I find them fairly easy.
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Postby Ciandin » Tue Apr 08, 2008 10:36 am

If your completely broke, at least get +10 stam armor kits for your shoulders, chest, hands, and feet. Thats over 500hp right there
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Now how about me...

Postby krazipanzer » Fri Apr 11, 2008 6:23 pm

Rather than clogging up the forums with another thread, figured I'd just post on this one. Just looking for some guidance as I try to get heroic ready. I recently respecced from holy and it's been a blast, though challenging. I was running Kara before, gearing up for Gruuls, when I got fed up with my guild insisting I stay holy when I wanted to try a Tankadin desperately. So I respecced, gquit and here I am with a 490 def. :)

However, I know I need work on my other stats. Block is ok, stam needs allot of work, armor is ok, parry ok, dodge sucks. Suggestions?

And don't hate on the PvP trinket. I've prevented far too many wipes both as a healer and a tank by being able to break fear/poly twice, rather just once with a bubble. I know I'll have to ditch it if I want to do serious raiding, but for right now I refuse to part with it. I <3 my trinket. :P

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Sargeras&n=Merkin
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Postby Snake-Aes » Fri Apr 11, 2008 6:55 pm

10kj unbuffed hp, 490 defense and knowing what the hell your gear should have.
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Postby krazipanzer » Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:08 pm

Snake-Aes wrote:10kj unbuffed hp, 490 defense and knowing what the hell your gear should have.


[/sarcasm] Thanks, that was really helpful [/sarcasm]

People like you are why I never post on forums. The point is to help the community by offering advise, not by being a smug ass. I can get that treatment on the official WoW forums.
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Re: Now how about me...

Postby Eirny » Fri Apr 11, 2008 8:47 pm

krazipanzer wrote:Rather than clogging up the forums with another thread, figured I'd just post on this one. Just looking for some guidance as I try to get heroic ready. I recently respecced from holy and it's been a blast, though challenging. I was running Kara before, gearing up for Gruuls, when I got fed up with my guild insisting I stay holy when I wanted to try a Tankadin desperately. So I respecced, gquit and here I am with a 490 def. :)

However, I know I need work on my other stats. Block is ok, stam needs allot of work, armor is ok, parry ok, dodge sucks. Suggestions?

And don't hate on the PvP trinket. I've prevented far too many wipes both as a healer and a tank by being able to break fear/poly twice, rather just once with a bubble. I know I'll have to ditch it if I want to do serious raiding, but for right now I refuse to part with it. I <3 my trinket. :P

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Sargeras&n=Merkin


Try taking a peek in here (lots of information): http://maintankadin.failsafedesign.com/ ... 63&start=0 as well as poking around in the rest of the gear forum.

First off, I'd say get some enchants (18 stam shield, 12 stam boots, 40 spell damage weapon, etc) as well as some upgrades (most of which are attainable through non-heroics and even some quests; jadeskull breastplate, Devil Shark Cloak, etc), and instead of gemming for spell damage at your gear level try some 9/12 stam gems, stam/def gems, or def gems instead.

Also, you may want to poke around in the talent spec forum as I really think you are missing out on all the extra threat One-handed Weapon Specialization could give you.
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Postby Brickhouse » Fri Apr 11, 2008 8:56 pm

When starting out, don't be afraid to USE crowd control. It is your friend. I know when I started out, it was hard to (1.) know how to use it..I was a tanking noob, and (2.) and it was hard to manage (consecrate) around it.

Spell damage was my most common enemy at these early heroic levels, because I simply did not have enough. I was too ignorant to know how important it was. =) Tomorrow my server will complete the Armory stage, and I will get some new pants from badges pushing my spell damage to around +640 or so, unbuffed. I will sacrifice a little stamina in the exchange, but I mostly just AoE tank anyway, in heroics or in raids. More avoidance is probably better if you main tank...but anyway, i digress.

1. use crowd control, and 2. get some spell damage + stamina. It is so easy to overlook spell damage, since there really is not a lot of paladin tank loot at early dungeon levels. So focused (at least I was) on getting that SWEET warrior chest with block or armor or avoidance or stamina..that over time, you have so little spell damage, you cannot do of the the two most important thanks a tank MUST do: (1. obviously, not die, have some stoutness about you), but also HOLD Aggro. It doesn't help if you are a brickwall, but nothing hits you, and instead ganks your healers.

At some point, when you get full good blues and some epics, you should be able to AoE tank most heroic instances. At least, large parts of most
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Postby Snake-Aes » Fri Apr 11, 2008 9:45 pm

krazipanzer wrote:
Snake-Aes wrote:10kj unbuffed hp, 490 defense and knowing what the hell your gear should have.


[/sarcasm] Thanks, that was really helpful [/sarcasm]

People like you are why I never post on forums. The point is to help the community by offering advise, not by being a smug ass. I can get that treatment on the official WoW forums.
I wasn't even talking about you, but the original poster.

Go play victim somewhere else. I wrote it in what seemed the simplest way of telling him what he needs.
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