Seal of Martyr and Reckoning

[vosprey]

So I've been testing out new ways of tanking, using a spec that includes Reckoning and Crusade

Since each of my SoV ticks for about 1k per tick, it was really generating good threat.

But using this reckoning/crusade spec and using seal of Martyr, it ticks for about 500 per swing, but that's not it...it can crit which is equal to the vengeance tick.

I'm not sure if the SoV ticks are over an elapse period of 3 sec but its my guest. (correct me)

SoM on the other hand hits 500 or 1k (depending on crit) every 1.6sec

Now this is where reckoning kicks in, especially if your are a main tank paladin. Since you are always being hit, and reckoning has a 10% chance of proccing on either a block or any type of damage.

This means that SoM is doubled, ending in more threat.

P.S: When i talk about SoV I'm talking about it at 5stack, I also included the 10% bonus from the t8.

Discuss, and if you have another ideas.

This could also work with SoR. Instead of using Crusade and the 3 points in conviction, you put it in SotP(15% more damage from (sotP).
Then, glyphing into 10% damage bonus. Not to mention the 10% damage from t8 2set bonus.

On the down side, it cant crit.

[Fridmarr]

We've had a few threads on this, and I think Theck's analysis touches on it too, in all the data I've seen SoV usually wins, or the difference is negligible. SoV will tick if you miss, are dodged, or parried. I believe SoB further can be missed, dodged, or parried, the end result in typical levels of +hit and +expertise is that SoV is most likely what you want to use, considering there is no backlash.

[Levantine]

It's been covered. Vengeance wins. Results are in one of theck's many many many matlab analyses.

[theckhd]

The most recent simulations suggest that in a high-hit, high-expertise set (i.e. near hit-cap and dodge soft-cap), Seal of Blood/Martyr can out-threat SoV for deep ret specs. Crusade is still a better talent than Reckoning, but using SoB makes Reckoning a much stronger threat return per talent point than it is with SoV (though it's still only around ~30 TPS per talent point, estimating from the graph).

By the way, the plots in that post show that if you're using SoBlood to tank, Broken Promise is your go-to tanking weapon until you get your hands on Sorthalis.

TLDR Summary:
In gear sets with high hit and expertise, SoB can be competitive with SoV for threat, even with tanking weapons. Theck still thinks this is a bad idea, but has these suggestions if you insist on emo-tanking:

• If you have 5/5 SotP, don't bother with SoB - it only works with deep Ret specs (3+ Conviction).
• If you have less than 200 Hit rating and 100 expertise rating (from gear alone!), don't even worry about SoB.
• Since there are no slow tanking weapons, you may choose to use a slow DPS weapon like Vulmir, the Northern Tempest if you're willing to give up some survivability for threat. Alternatively, Broken Promise is still quite good for SoB.
• Be smart about it. There's no reason to emo-tank every boss.
  
  • If you have a 30% threat lead over the highest DPS player, you don't need to emo-tank. Your emo tendencies are just increasing healing load on your healers for no benefit - your DPS still sucks. Switch to SoV.
  • If your DPS is riding your ass the whole fight, even with a perfect 969 (and you better be using a perfect 969 before you bother with this, because otherwise you'd get a bigger benefit by honing your 969 skills and not sucking at 969 than you would by emo-tanking), then you can start thinking about turning up the My Chemical Romance, putting on the black eyeshadow, and SoB-ing it up.